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I recently used this term to describe someone locally, and a German I know hadn't a clue what we were talking about. So I was wondering, does anyone know where this hiberno-English term for a "good-for-nothing" person comes from?

Declan wrote:I recently used this term to describe someone locally, and a German I know hadn't a clue what we were talking about. So I was wondering, does anyone know where this hiberno-English term for a "good-for-nothing" person comes from?

M'anam don diabhal! It's listed in the Dictionary of Hiberno-English, but wouldn't you know it's exactly that page which isn't previewable online. We have a copy at work, however, so I'll check tomorrow.

(I imagine you found the same hits I did which claim an etymology of "leath-tiochog" [sic]. But given that these gloss the second word as "bag; bollock", I don't trust them.)

Hey Linguoboy, I was just wondering did you ever get to check that up? I've been asking around a bit more, and all I could come up with was a doubtful connection to "latching on to", but I don't think the person who told me believed that one!

Declan wrote:Hey Linguoboy, I was just wondering did you ever get to check that up? I've been asking around a bit more, and all I could come up with was a doubtful connection to "latching on to", but I don't think the person who told me believed that one!

All I found was more speculation. Among the leading theories:

1. A derivative of Scots latch "an indolent, dilatory person, a dawdler". This seems to me the most plausible of the bunch.

2. From latch in the sense of "door latch", referring to what (in the USA at least) are known as "latchkey kids", i.e. children who let themselves in after school and are left unsupervised until their parents come home from work.

3. From (Mayo) Irish leath-tiochóg "half-bag [dim.]". I've got several problems with this, not the least of which is that the phonetics don't really work out.

Obviously it would help a lot to know where the earliest attestations were. An Irish etymology doesn't make much sense for east Ulster, and likewise a Scots etymology for Mayo.

Interesting, thanks. It doesn't sound like a particularly Hiberno-English word to me, which is probably why I took no notice of it. The Scots connection also seems the most likely route to me.